Reintroducing Leading Learning

The Leading Learning Podcast is just one part of what we do at Leading Learning. In this episode, we reintroduce Leading Learning and the range of resources, education, and insights Learning Learning provides to learning business professionals.

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Intro: [00:00:00]

Celisa Steele: [00:00:25] This is, as you just said, Jeff, as we say every week, the Leading Learning Podcast, but the podcast is just one part of what we do at Leading Learning.

Jeff Cobb: [00:00:36] So true, and you and I were talking about how we might be due to reintroduce Leading Learning to listeners, as some may not know about the other things we offer—or they may simply have forgotten.

Celisa Steele: [00:00:48] So, in this episode, number 374, we’re going to reintroduce Leading Learning. In brief, Leading Learning provides resources, education, and insights to learning business professionals, and we provide those resources, education, and insights via several avenues, of which the Leading Learning Podcast is just one.

Jeff Cobb: [00:01:10] And we want to highlight those various avenues, but, first, it seems like we should touch on two key terms.

Learning Businesses and Learning Business Professionals

Celisa Steele: [00:01:18] Yes, I think we should at least touch on what we mean by “learning business” and what we mean by “learning business professional.”

Jeff Cobb: [00:01:26] Those are indeed central to everything we do here. Yes, let’s be clear about that upfront, as we have before. But, like this reintroduction, this bears repeating. Let’s make sure people understand what we’re focused on here.

And the term “learning business” we coined—or maybe we can say we co-opted it—because there really was no good term that existed to describe and unite the various types of organizations that are really serving that learning business landscape, that adult lifelong learning, continuing education, professional development market.

Jeff Cobb

Celisa Steele: [00:02:01] Right. And some people might say at first blush, “Oh, learning business. Oh, you’re talking about a learning organization.”

Celisa Steele: [00:02:08] This is a different term than that. We believe that learning businesses would benefit by also being learning organizations—this idea that the organization’s incorporating lessons learned, doing things differently and better based on what it knows about its own performance, but that’s different than a learning business.

Jeff Cobb: [00:02:26] Right. And so what we’re really talking about is this huge but really overlooked and under-appreciated area of education, something we’ve described as the third sector of education that really plays a central role in every human society, and it’s just become more and more important given the more recent shifts that we’ve seen in things like technology and the global economy and the fact that we’re living longer, and the nature of jobs and careers have changed. And, boy, just change in general, it seems to be so fast these days. And so there’s this need for organizations that serve adults throughout their lifetime, provide them with the education, training, the knowledge that they need to navigate this world that we live in right now. And those organizations exist, but, as we said, they have not really been well defined and appreciated in the past.

Celisa Steele: [00:03:26] I think to the extent that they have had a sense of collectivity, a sense of others being involved in this, it’s more siloed than we would think is beneficial. For example, you have trade and professional associations, and there’s the American Society of Association Executives (ASAE) that really focuses on associations. Very often, associations have a learning business as a major part of what they do; they’re trying to help move the needle through education and training in whatever field or profession they serve. Definitely, trade and professional associations are learning businesses, but they also share a lot in common with other learning businesses, which can include commercial training firms, consulting firms, PCO units (college and university professional, continuing, and online education units), which is the acronym that gets used there in the higher-ed space.

Jeff Cobb: [00:04:28] Right. So all of those types of organizations, which we characterize as businesses, are serving this market for adult lifelong learning. And so, in our minds, you have this K-12 sector, that pre-K-12, ideally, that’s well-recognized—people know what you’re talking about when you say that. You have higher education that’s out there—people know what you’re talking about when you say that. But, then, we believe in this third sector of education, which is one that these types of learning businesses serve and play a really fundamental role in society if you think about it. We talk about the other 50 years. You also hear terms like the “60-year curriculum.” But most people are done with K-12 and higher education by the time they’re in their early to mid-20s if they’re lucky enough to get through higher education—that’s still not something that everybody gets at this point. But, then, you’ve got 50, 60, 70 years in front of you to navigate your life and your career. And so having organizations that are dedicated to doing that is essential, and it’s just a fact that that’s a business. K-12 is funded by government. Higher education, very expensive but funded by government as well. Once you get out into the lifelong learning space, it’s a little bit of a different game.

Celisa Steele: [00:05:46] Right. And I’ll add a couple notes. One, of course, you’re speaking from a U.S.-centric viewpoint of earlier education. But, then, the other thing I would add, too, is that learning businesses are not corporate L&D, and that’s another important distinction that we have in mind. Learning and development professionals have the benefit, maybe the challenge of dealing with a captive audience. They can say to employees, “Here, you need to take this diversity, equity, and inclusion training,” and you can make sure that they do it, or you can fire them, essentially. But learning businesses much more often have to make that case to a buyer—which may be the individual learner, may be the company that hires that individual learner—but the learning business has to make the case that “Hey, we have the products and services that you need to really grow and improve.”

Jeff Cobb: [00:06:39] Market-facing. You definitely have to be market-facing with what you’re offering. And we really view it as different from something like an academic degree program as well because we’re really talking about the continuing education, the ongoing professional learning, personal learning that you get after you’ve completed those earlier parts of education, of which higher education is an important part. As you mentioned, within academic institutions, you’re often going to have those professional, continuing, and online education units, the PCO units, that are doing just that, and those are the parts of the higher-education world that we think of as being in the learning business.

Celisa Steele: [00:07:15] So that’s a recap of what we mean by “learning business.” Now, the other key term that we should touch on here, upfront, is “learning business professional” because we talk about serving learning business professionals at Leading Learning. In essence, a learning business professional is simply someone who works in a learning business.

Jeff Cobb: [00:07:35] Right. This is somebody who, ideally, recognizes that they are in business, and learning is what they’re doing for their business. To extend what you already said about corporate L&D, this is different from working in a corporate L&D department or at an academic degree program because you are thinking so much about that market component, and you’re thinking about that adult lifelong learner. And, yes, you have to wrestle with how does learning happen effectively, but you’ve also got to wrestle with the business side of it. I was on a call just yesterday, as of the time that we’re doing this podcast recording, with some folks from the University Professional and Continuing Education Association (UPCEA), and the whole call was about how to price credentialing programs. And so dealing with price, you don’t typically have to do that as a corporate L&D department. And even most people who are in an academic degree program, yes, price is an issue, but they’re not thinking about it most of the time. You’re not thinking about the fact that you’re in a market with the education that you’re offering.

Celisa Steele: [00:08:45] Right. I think, in those contexts, you tend to think more about cost rather than this idea of price and what the value might be to the market. Learning business professionals, they work in learning businesses and hopefully have, as you said, Jeff, that awareness that they’re working in learning businesses, and they appreciate the business side of things as well as the learning side of things.

And so, if you identify as someone who serves that market for continuing education, professional development, lifelong learning, then Leading Learning is for you.

Celisa Steele

Jeff Cobb: [00:09:16] Hopefully, you’re listening right now and saying, “Oh, yes, yes, that’s me. I’ve just spent the last five minutes listening to something that I completely identify with.” And, if that’s not the case, this might be the time to move on to another podcast.

Celisa Steele: [00:09:30] Well, what I was thinking about, too, was our old podcast intro. We used to say, “If you’re a leader or an aspiring leader in the business of lifelong learning, you’re in the right place.” Again, it’s around this recognition that you’re a learning business professional. That’s who we’ve developed Leading Learning for. That’s who we continue to want to serve through Leading Learning.

Partner with Tagoras

[00:09:56] At Tagoras, we’re experts in the global business of lifelong learning, and we use our expertise to help clients better understand their markets, connect with new customers, make the right investment decisions, and grow their learning businesses.

We achieve these goals through expert market assessment, strategy formulation, and platform selection services. If you are looking for a partner to help your learning business achieve greater reach, revenue, and impact, learn more at tagoras.com/services.

How Leading Learning Helps Learning Business Professionals

Leading Learning Podcast

Celisa Steele: [00:10:26] So one of the avenues of how we help learning business professionals at Leading Learning is through the Leading Learning Podcast. Maybe we can just do a brief history on the podcast. We started back in 2015, and, really, the impetus for it was our first place-based conference, the Leading Learning Symposium. We’ll touch a little bit more on events a little bit later in this episode. But we really saw a podcast as a way to highlight some of the thought leaders who would be coming to lead sessions at that symposium and also to provide some pre-content to really level-set attendees so that they came in with some of the same concepts and terminology in mind, hopefully.

Jeff Cobb: [00:11:08] Yes, we were using it mostly as a learning tool to help level-set a little bit, give people some common, prior knowledge coming into that event so that the event itself could be much more effective. At the time, I don’t think either one of us was thinking that we’d be talking 370-something episodes later about the podcast.

Celisa Steele: [00:11:35] Right, 374.

Jeff Cobb: [00:11:37] Three hundred and seventy-four, to be exact.

Celisa Steele: [00:11:38] And so we’ve published roughly weekly since we first started in 2015, though we did take a little bit of a break from a weekly schedule in late 2020 and then into 2021. We experimented a little bit with some series. We would have seven episodes that were tied to an overarching theme, like learning science, for example, and we’d craft that series with an overarching progression and plan, and then we’d take some time off because it took a lot of work to create the series. But we also found that we felt like the listenership, from what we could see of how folks were interacting with the podcast, that they appreciated that weekly touchstone. And so we went back in 2022 to a weekly format, and that’s what we’ve been doing since we returned.

Jeff Cobb: [00:12:31] Yes. I think, personally, that was some great work. We enjoyed doing it and thought that that was a really good way to use the podcast, but, as you said, we want to give listeners what listeners seem to be looking for. We do recommend that people go back and check those out, though, and we’ll make sure that we link to those. Our current plan—and we were doing this before those series, and we’re continuing to do this—is that we do an episode that’s the two of us, like we’re doing right now, just Celisa and Jeff having a conversation. And then we do me, Jeff, doing an interview with somebody, some expert or other person out there in the learning business landscape. And then, Celisa, you do an interview, and then we repeat that cycle.

Celisa Steele: [00:13:12] Our focus is on practical and actionable topics and ideas, but we do also like to explore things that we believe learning business professionals should be thinking about. So, while we believe there’s a lot of value in what’s the quick-and-dirty thing you can go and do that’s going to help you more with your marketing or help you make your products more effective, we also think that there are some bigger topics that are definitely worth digging into, to be thinking about, but they may not have that immediately applicable thing that comes out of a 30-minute podcast. I’m thinking about big issues or big changes, like artificial intelligence. I’m thinking about things like diversity, equity, inclusion—obviously a huge issue to be grappling with. So we want to focus on what we really believe is important, and, whenever possible, then we also want to make sure that that important thing translates into something practical or actionable.

Jeff Cobb: [00:14:11] Right. And, to guide us in what we do, we use the Learning Business Maturity Model domains, and we’ve talked about the Learning Business Maturity Model on the show a number of times. But that really defines the stages that a learning business can go through, going towards maturity, and, within those stages, five domains that learning businesses need to attend to, basically. And those are strategy, marketing, capacity, portfolio (which we call simply “learning” on the Leading Learning site), leadership, and then we also fold in there trends. This isn’t like a strict set of parameters we’re using, but it’s a set of guardrails, I guess, to keep us on the right path as we go down this journey of the Leading Learning Podcast.

Celisa Steele: [00:15:01] Right. So, when we’re thinking about interviewees, or we’re thinking about topics that we want to discuss, we have those domains in mind, and usually we’re aware of an episode mapping pretty clearly to at least one and sometimes more than one of those five domains or that bonus trends category there. You mentioned the Learning Business Maturity Model, and so I think we should also talk a little bit about tools because I think that’s another avenue by which Leading Learning can support learning business professionals. And we did a series of Tool Talks for the podcast to highlight many of those tools, which include things like the Value Ramp, the Market Insight Matrix, and the Product Value Profile.

Jeff Cobb: [00:15:58] There are a number of them, and these are free. And, really, what they are, they’re thought tools, basically, because they give you a way to get a new perspective on a situation or diagnose a situation, whether by yourself or very useful to use with a team of people, whether that’s your learning business team, or, if you’re in a larger organization that has other parts of the organization, you might involve them in that as well. But you can, for example, look at something like the Value Ramp, which is really all about the correspondence or the correlation between price and value and mapping out your portfolio in terms of pricing and value, and just that very simple tool can really provoke a lot of good insight and discussion around the state of your portfolio and what you might need to consider in terms of product strategy going forward.

Celisa Steele: [00:16:48] And I’ll note that most of these tools come out of Tagoras, so they’re not typically branded Leading Learning. They’re actually branded Tagoras. Tagoras is Leading Learning’s parent company.

Jeff Cobb: [00:17:00] Right. We’ve developed these tools because we have found them useful in the context of consulting with and advising organizations, not to mention using them within our own company, organization to help us think through these things, and we’ve decided to make them available as a free resource through Leading Learning because Leading Learning is really where we do make free or lower-cost resources available, other than consulting. Tagoras is really where we’re doing larger consulting projects—those are paid. Those are a big part of our revenue generation for the business.

But either way—Tagoras with the consulting or Leading Learning with those free or low-cost resources—they’re both focused on learning businesses and helping them to improve their reach, revenue, and impact, and that’s what those tools are all about, whichever context we’re using them in.

Jeff Cobb

Leading Learning Blog

Celisa Steele: [00:18:03] Another avenue that Leading Learning uses to support learning business professionals is a blog, and we use the same structure that we use for the podcast for the blog. So we’re using those five domains from the maturity model plus the bonus category of trends. In the model, we call one of the domains “portfolio.” On the Web site leadinglearning.com, we call it “learning” instead. But, again, we’ve identified these areas as places where learning businesses really need to focus some time and attention, and so we’re trying to provide resources on the blog in terms of written content that might help as you’re thinking through one or more of those domains.

Jeff Cobb: [00:18:49] I’ll say that, relative to both the blog and the podcast, it’s more focused on the podcast right now, but there is also blog content in there, and we’re continuing to evolve it over time. We have put together what we call the “informal learning business curriculum,” which you’ll find various links to that throughout the site. But that’s taking some of those key podcast episodes, some blog content and pulling it together into those domains and saying, “Here’s how you can focus yourself as you’re thinking about your learning business.” Perhaps have your team listen to those particular episodes or read those particular posts, and have them as a point of discussion. We do also have the tools that we’ve just referenced highlighted there as well. So that learning business curriculum, I guess, is itself a macro tool within the site that really pulls together some of these different resources that we’re talking about.

Celisa Steele: [00:19:50] And I’ll note, too, that we are looking to get into a more regular cadence of adding fresh content to the blog. As you just acknowledged, Jeff, we’ve been a little more focused on the podcast in recent months, but we’d like to get back to regularly adding to what’s available in the form of written content on the blog. But, even though there’s not a ton of fresh, brand-new stuff there, what is there, I do think, is still very useful. And I’m not even saying that in a self-serving way. A lot of the content has been written by us, but we’ve also worked with learning business professionals and gotten them to contribute posts about something going on in their organization, and so I think there’s a lot that can be really valuable there. So we encourage you to know about this as a resource and to check it out.

Jeff Cobb: [00:20:41] And, I think, in terms of our philosophy around what we publish, particularly on the blog—it may apply less to the podcast and to some of the other things we’ll talk about—but we want it to have a long shelf life. We want to write about things that are going to be of perennial interest, perennial usefulness. And, with the blog, you can go back and update that stuff much more easily than you can with a podcast, where, obviously, we’ve committed it to audio, and we’re not going to go back and edit our audio. But we can always go back and edit our text and make sure that things are up-to-date and relevant, and we do that as part of maintaining the Leading Learning site.

Leading Learning Webinars

Celisa Steele: [00:21:15] Another avenue we want to make sure to mention is Webinars. We have a Leading Learning Webinar series. We usually run about eight or so in a calendar year, and those are typically an hour long, although we have begun experimenting a little bit, sometimes with some shorter 30-minute sessions as well. But we always try to make them learning experiences. So we try not to treat them as pure broadcast format, where it’s just us or any speaker we might bring in talking at you for 30 to 60 minutes. We try to build in pauses for reflection. We try to get attendees sharing in the chat. And so this is a plug for tuning into the Webinars and making time to participate live during the scheduled time, whenever that’s possible on your calendar, because we really believe that there is added value that comes out of you being there during that scheduled time. We always build in time for Q&A as well, and so that gives you that chance to ask us or anyone else presenting with us your specific questions to try to make that content as relevant for your learning business as possible.

Jeff Cobb: [00:22:28] And we should mention that those Webinars are, more often than not, sponsored. We do have companies that work in the learning business landscape that are obviously interested in our audience knowing about them, but we strive very hard, and I think that people who’ve attended the Webinars would agree that they are not commercials. We, of course, are going to provide some information about the sponsors because that’s just part of the deal, and it’s part of what gives us the revenue we need to be able to keep Leading Learning going. But, in many cases, we’ll work closely with the sponsor to help craft the content and make it more relevant. In all cases, it’s going to be educationally focused. And, as you said, Celisa, we want it to be an experience, interactive. We’ve had situations where the chat has just been really on fire, people are sharing great stuff in the chat, so it is really good to attend them live and get that experience.

Celisa Steele: [00:23:22] We have a few Webinars that we tend to essentially rerun periodically. So we have “LMS Selection in the Evolving Learning Landscape” that we typically offer once a year. We just happen to have a tremendous wealth of knowledge around learning management systems and how they get used in learning businesses, and we’re aware of systems that are good fits for learning businesses in particular. And so this is one of our ways of sharing some of that information that can hopefully help any organization looking for a new or replacement LMS just do that, go through that process in as effective a way as possible. We also run a “Learning Business Landscape” annual Webinar, where we typically hold that near the end of the calendar year (November or December), and what we do is look back at the year that was—we look at key trends and developments—and then we also begin to look ahead and see what might be carried forward from this year into the next and what’s going to matter as we’re really turning the page into January.

Jeff Cobb: [00:24:30] Right. And, again, as with the blog and the podcast, we are looking to the Learning Business Maturity Model as a point of reference many times for these. So we have had, a number of times, Webinars around things like strategy, pricing, around market assessment, which is a huge part of our consulting business, and so we can definitely talk about that quite a bit. Again, those bread-and-butter perennial topics—issues that anybody working in a learning business is going to just always be coming back to and coming back to probably in a different place than they were the last time. So it’s good material to return to.

Celisa Steele: [00:25:07] Sometimes they’re a little bit more topical. We had a Webinar around “How to Turn the Great Resignation into a Great Credentialing Opportunity,” for example. And, obviously, that was picking up on something that was happening in society—the Great Resignation—but, then, trying to think about what are the implications for learning businesses. We’ve also offered a Webinar on “Learning Science: Implications for Your Learning Business,” and we’ve offered one called “Building Your Blended Learning Playbook,” and that Webinar actually shared some key points from an executive briefing, which leads us nicely into another avenue of resources that Leading Learning provides that we should talk about.

Jeff Cobb: [00:25:47] That’s true. From the beginning, from the early days of Tagoras as a company, which preceded Leading Learning itself, we’ve always done a lot of research, published a lot of research based on surveys, based on our own secondary research of sources, and we have started to do more short-form research in the form of executive briefings that, again, tend to be things that are sponsored, that we’re working with some of our vendor partners in creating. But those have included things like “Why and How to Build Your Blended Learning Playbook,” “Content, Practice, and Credentials: Building a Virtuous Learning Cycle,” “Conquering the Confusion: The Role of the LMS in the Evolving Learntech Landscape.” You can find these in the navigation for the site currently. We always make sure there’s a good path to get to them. Those, as with most of what you’ll find at Leading Learning, are free, and we do make every effort to make sure that they’re full of valuable insights and content that you can use in making decisions within your learning business.

Celisa Steele: [00:26:56] You shared three titles of executive briefings that are already out there and available. I will also mention briefly that we are working currently on a new executive briefing that’s going to focus on practice, and we’ve tentatively titled it “Practice Makes Profit,” but that’ll be out later in 2023.

Leading Learning Events

Jeff Cobb: [00:27:24] So we’ve covered a number of areas that have to do with publishing content in various forms, from podcasts to blogs to reports and research. We’ve also referenced Webinars, and that points to something else that is really an important part of Leading Learning, and that’s events, experiences that we create. And we’ve done a number of different types of events in the past, some place-based, some online. We’ve already referenced it as the inspiration for the podcast originally. We used to hold the Leading Learning Symposium, which was a place-based event for learning business leaders. Basically, we did that for a couple of years. Might be something we return to, or we’re trying to decide what we do with place-based events going forward. We had actually discontinued that even before COVID came along, but then COVID obviously put a damper on reconsidering place-based events there for a while, but it’s in our minds. Then we have had some very important online events as well, which, I’ll say, we started doing before COVID came along. We were doing virtual before virtual was cool.

Celisa Steele: [00:28:30] That’s right. Learning • Technology • Design (or LTD for short) that actually started as an in-person conference as well, but then we moved it online. Actually, the last time that we offered it was in 2020, just about a month before the world shut down because of COVID. So that was really focused on, as you hear in the name three key areas—learning, technology, and design—and really trying to provide content and resources in each of those areas to help learning businesses. And then we’ve also done an online demonstration event geared towards learning management systems called Live Review, in partnership with our ReviewMyLMS site.

Jeff Cobb: [00:29:15] And we’ve been doing that for a number of years now. It provides a very convenient, very low cost…because, in most cases, it’s been free. I think there was one year where we charged a little bit for it, but, so far, it’s been mostly free, and you get very convenient access to see demonstrations of platforms that are a good fit for learning businesses. We did start to evolve Live Review in the version this year, in 2023, and start adding education sessions into it, and we’re going to continue to evolve that event going into 2024 and really make it probably more of a learning business summit of sorts, an event that’s really focused on being in the learning business, though it will still have that demonstration component to it as well.

Celisa Steele: [00:30:03] And so we don’t yet know exactly what form that event will take. We just know that it’s going to be coming early on in 2024. I would say that one of the best ways to make sure that you are aware of what we’re doing there is to make sure that you are on the Leading Learning newsletter list.

Leading Learning Newsletter

Jeff Cobb: [00:30:22] And what a great item to end on, the Leading Learning newsletter, and what we do there. And, really, the newsletter—I guess we use it as an umbrella term—it’s how we’re e-mail-communicating with the community that’s formed around Leading Learning, and there are different aspects to it. We do a podcast digest as part of it. So, on the first Tuesday of every month (at least as of this recording, that’s when we do this), we send out a digest that covers the podcast episodes we’ve had in the previous month. You have an easy way to see what was on the podcast, link to it. You get a little blurb about it—just a very convenient way to know what that content has been if you haven’t been subscribed and following it all along. Or even if you have, and you just need a reminder. And then, on the third Tuesday of every month (and, again, that’s as of this recording, subject to change, but this is what we aim for), we send out what we call Leading Links, which is our collection of curated links to different resources that we think are going to be valuable, useful, and actionable for learning business leaders and learning business professionals.

Jeff Cobb: [00:31:35] And so, in both that and the podcast digest, we’ll highlight things that are coming up, like Webinars or the events that we’ve just been talking about. But then we also provide the links to different resources in Leading Links, and once again the Learning Business Maturity Model is lying behind things. And sometimes we’ll call that out, sometimes we won’t, but you’ll always see that we organize links in Leading Links according to leadership, strategy, marketing, capacity, portfolio, and we’ll find good resources to link to in most issues in each of those areas. Sometimes we don’t come across a great resource in one of the areas, so we’ll skip it for that particular issue, but we do that on an ongoing basis. We’ve also, more recently, added an AI Watch section to it since AI is such a big thing right now. But a valuable resource that we publish on an ongoing basis. We do also provide other periodic e-mails to subscribers to that list, specifically about an upcoming Webinar or other opportunity that we think readers would want to know about.

Celisa Steele: [00:32:39] If you’re listening to this, and you’re getting a fuller sense of what Leading Learning has to offer beyond the podcast, one key takeaway would be to make sure that you’re subscribed to that Leading Learning newsletter because it really is the best way to keep up with all that we have going on. When we have a new executive briefing, we’ll make sure that people subscribed to the newsletter know about it. When we schedule a new Webinar, we’ll make sure that you know about it. When there are developing trends or if we are having any events like this Q1 2024 event that we’ve mentioned in this episode, you’ll be aware of that if you’re subscribed to the newsletter. So, if you’re not already, please sign up for the newsletter.

Jeff Cobb: [00:33:22] The newsletter is the pulse of Leading Learning, and we believe it’s the pulse of the learning business landscape.

The Goals of Leading Learning

Celisa Steele: [00:33:35] So, to sum up, the goals with all we do under Leading Learning are to, one, raise awareness of the critical role that learning businesses play in society; two, to help learning businesses increase the reach, revenue, and impact of their offerings; and, three, to support individual learning professionals in achieving high levels of performance in their work—meaning, we want to help you, dear listener.

We truly believe that learning businesses and the people who work for them change the world on a daily basis, and we want to do everything we can to help them in that work.

Celisa Steele

Wrap-up: [00:34:13]

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Related Resources

• About Leading Learning (page on the Leading Learning site)
• Leading Learning Webinars (page on the Leading Learning site)
• Leading Learning Podcast (page on the Leading Learning site)
• Leading Learning Newsletter (page on the Leading Learning site)
• Leading Learning Executive Briefings (page on the Leading Learning site)